CS Navy Bormann

[6lbgun]

     On September 15, 1863 Acting Master C. A. McEvoy (who also invented the fuse igniter) tested eight Bormann fuses that the navy produced at the CS Navel Laboratory in Richmond as per Brooke's orders.
They were tested in a shell fired from a 12lb Boat Howitzer.  The results were "very satisfactory".  Further trial was suggested.
     Does any one out there know if the Bormanns were adopted by the CS Navy and put into production?
Thanks
Dan

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Dan,
   they were produced for field service and can think of no reason why the navy would not have addopted them too. However, no documentation, just a guess.
Regards,
John

[6lbgun]

John,
     This was nine months after the army's Ordnance Department discontinued manufacturing bormanns
in Dec. 1862.
Dan

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Dan,
I was unaware when the field service use had stopped. I would have thought that the Navy would have liked them over fuse adapters due the dampness attacking the paper time fuses.
Regards
John

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Doesn't anyone have a photo of the C.S. Navy Bormann? Mike, Pete....
Regards,
John

[joevann]

Hmmmm.  If someone had a photo of a CS Navy Bormann, I think we'd already have the answer to the original question....   Sorry, John, couldn't help myself.

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Thanks John I guess we will have to rely on Pete or Mike to tell us the answer......
Warm Regards,
John

[Pete George]

John D. Bartleson Jr. wrote:
>  I guess we will have to rely on Pete or Mike to tell us the answer.

  The reason I haven't already replied on this subject is that I do not have "the answer" to the mystery.

  In all my decades of examining and researching civil war artillery projectiles, I've never seen or heard or read anything about a "Confederate Navy Bormann fuze"... until 6lbgun's post. The report is deeply mystifying, for two major reasons:
1- As has already been said, the CS Army Arsenals discontinued production of the Bormann fuze approximately nine months before the date of the report cited by 6lbgun -- for very good reasons.
2- Both sides in the war discontinued usage of the 5/5.25/5.5-second Bormann fuze in Rifled-cannon shells after early-1862 because that fuze's short burning-time limit was of little use in those longer-ranged cannons. (It was only useful for up to approximately 1 mile of range.) Although the US Navy briefly employed a 10-second version, it too was discontinued after the earlier-war period, due to its short range limitation.

  In view of the lessons learned in 1861-62, if a CS Navy version manufactured in the second half of 1863 ever progressed beyond the experimental testing stage, theoretically it would go beyond 5-&-1/2 seconds on its time-index. But the only American-made Bormann fuze which is "publicly known" to have been found that goes beyond 5-&-1/2-seconds of burning-time is the US Navy's 10-second version.

  Therefore, APPARENTLY, the version mentioned in the CS September 1863 report never progressed beyond experimental testing, OR it was indistinguishable from the well-known Army 5-&-1/2-seconds version.

Regards,
Pete

[Steve Phillips]

I want to give my 2 cents worth, and that is all my opinion is worth. Over the last 40+ years of diving at Selma I have found many 24 lb poly cavity Borman fuzed shells. These are well marked with Selma marks and were at Selma in April 1865. Selma didn't get started as early as other places and I don't think they would have stored these for years. They were found on the Navy side, not near the army arsenal which doesn't really mean much since various manufacturers were all over town and their stuff was discarded where they could. Not every thing was written down.

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Yes - No - Perhaps - All the Above!
Make your selection Dan.....
Regards,
John

[6lbgun]

Thanks to all for their replies.
     The following is found in the Brooke papers dated 16 Sept, 1863.
Acting Master Charles A McEvoy, Richmond, to Brooke BP
I beg leave to submit the following report of the trial of Bormann fuzes made on the 15th inst. in compliance with your order.
The fuzes - eight in number - were made at the CS Naval Laboratory, Richmond, inserted in shell, and fired from a 12 pdr. Boat Howitzer.
Charge of powder used 1. lb.
The first four fuzes were cut at 3 seconds, two of which exploded in three seconds - one at 4 and the other at 41/2, after leaving the gun.
The remaining four were cut - 3 at 4, and the other at 5 seconds, all of which exploded in proper time.
The results may be considered very satisfactory from the fact that all the shells exploded, with the exception of 2, in proper time, and none failed to explode at some time, but in no instance prematurely.  Yet I think that it would be advisable to give them further trial before making a large number of them.
     From the fact that the max time they were tested at was 5 seconds, I believe that they were 5.5 second Bormanns.  Did the Naval Laboratory ever discontinue making them like the arsenals?  5.5 seconds would work fine in a boat Howitzer.  I don't think that they looked any different than any other CS Bormann.  Wanted to know whether these trial went any further.
Thanks
Dan