Help with id of Union (perhaps?) mystery projectile...

[rynegold]

I got these in trade today; one's a Parrott round; 30lb.??

 

 



 

And the other is.... what? and is this detonator live? it "looks" like a copper nose. this round is big: its got to weigh 60lbs. +. It has been drilled in two places on the other side (about 1/2 inch holes) and is approx. 6 to 6.5 inches in diameter.

 

 

thanks ,

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Sir;
     The second one is a British Bashley Britten shell and Britten percussion fuze. The lead sabot is missing and probably has been fired The fuze looks to pristene to have had impact and has probbly been placed in the shell as a fuze of opportunity.  The two holes doesn't really mean that all the powder has been removed. So be warned.
     Let us see the base nad nose view of the first one. . 
If the first one has a solid looking nose then it appears to be a Parrot but can't determine its diameter. Is it solid or does it have a fuze? I notice it has also been drilled. If it is solid and a bolt then the person who drilled it does not know what he was doing.
Regards,
John

[rynegold]

Greetings John... I'll shoot some pix tomorrow morn and post'em.


regards, mitch


So; this is a CSA round?? yes?


Just curious, but what kind of value do these rounds (in a condition similar to mine) bring?

[CarlS]

The first one most assuredly looks to be a 30 pounder Parrott "bottle nose" bolt.  It is missing the copper sabot but is in nice shape.  Many are known to have been found at the Vicksburg campaign.  As John indicates it was unneeded to drill the hole in it given it's a solid cast projectile designed to knock down things.  If threaded the hole might have been used to attach a wire for electrolysis or it might have been put there to show the authorities that it's safe.  Hard to say for sure unless you can ask whomever drilled it.

The 2nd one is a pretty rare bird with a nice fuse.   Good that it's drilled but keep in mind a hole isn't what makes a shell disarmed.  If the powder is not washed out good it's still live.

Do you know where they were found?

[CarlS]

I forgot to answer your questions.  The first one is definitely a product of the invading army; i.e. the Union.  The 2nd one was most likely made by the British.

[rynegold]

Do you know where they were found?

Mobile, Alabama

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Sir,
     With regard to your projectiles value I would suggest that you visit some Internet venders sites.
Can you post some close-ups of the British fuze?
Regards,
John

[emike123]

You are not going to find a price for the Britten on internet sites because it is infrequently encountered.  The iron looks very nice with one "challenged" area around the nose.  The fuse is a good one, but the missing sabot is a bummer, although typical of the type when fired.   Replacing the sabot will be a very costly challenge and I'm not sure how it would look.  A value is a pure guess, but it is several orders of magnitude dearer than the Parrott bolt. 

If it is available for sale or trade, I might be interested in acquiring it.  PM or eMail me if that is the case.

The 30pdr Parrott is also missing its sabot but as Carl noted with good iron.  I'd say retail of $225 for it.  We have one on the main site for $295 that has its sabot, but not much interest has been shown in it to date.  It is also from the Mobile area where a lot of these were fired from US Navy ships at the various Confederate fortifications.

[rynegold]

     The fuze looks to pristene to have had impact and has probbly been placed in the shell as a fuze of opportunity.  The two holes doesn't really mean that all the powder has been removed. So be warned.
     

John; here's some shots of the fuse.... if that was "an installation of opportunity" it was sure done long ago...

[emike123]

In my opinion the fuse is original to the Britten shell.

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Sir;
   I guess the shell could have landed base first sparing the fuze of damage.
 Do you know who may have drilled the shell?  Looking at my drawing one would normally select a base entry in order to gain access to the entire length of the column of powder.
   I think I would fill it with hot water and let it stand on its cushioned nose in a bucket of water for a couple of weeks.
   I am not sayhing YOU should atempt to drill the base, please understand this.
At least this would soak the fuze area.
Perhaps the person who drilled it for you could remove the cap to see if it has fired.  I presume this person uses remote techniques.
2.  Are you satified that the Parrott is a bolt. (solid nose)?
Regards,
John
P.S. Normally when a shell hits the ground nose first the powder is thrown to the fuze area and is sometimes so compacted that it becomes like hard clay over the years.  The powder can become so hard that normal wahing out with water will not disolve it.  Then after drying out the powder can return to its dangerous state.

[emike123]

The Parrott is absolutely a bolt.  That type is called a "bottlenose" bolt for obvious reasons.

The fuse is British so would have left hand threads and unscrew the opposite to the way our stuff unscrews.  I do not recommend trying to take it out as the fuse is one of, if not the, nicest aspect of the shell.

Another member uses a method to get caked powder out of shells of injecting sudsy ammonia and then corking the hole(s).  He leaves it a week and then pours out the goop.  Presumably this can be repeated until one feels assured that the caked powder is removed.  I personally do not mess with them, but thats the method I was told of.

[Selma Hunter]

Fellas -

That this shell might have been a "water impact" could go a long way towards explaining the condition of the fuze assembly.  It is easy to overlook the fact that Mobile was both a land and sea (water) campaign that didn't end until April of 1865 - that is a long time to be under siege and blockade.  There was a lot of iron "exchanged" by both sides - wet and dry.