Bullet and Shell Civil War Projectiles Forum

Relic Discussion => Artillery => Topic started by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 22, 2011, 04:45:08 PM

Title: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 22, 2011, 04:45:08 PM

To All Interested;
     A closer look at Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot system. Said to  reduce the amount of copper in the normal Brooke ratchet sabot.
Regards,
John

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 22, 2011, 11:45:14 PM

Nice work, John.  Thanks for sharing.

I have to jump on this post because a few weeks ago I picked up a couple groundburst 7" Brookes and one has a ratchet ring sabot while the other has the disc sabot.  Both are from the same late war site.

I think they are really cool.  I need Sham's magic touch to restore them better without the black JB Weld (not my work!), but they're still cool to this artillery nerd.

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 23, 2011, 08:38:44 AM

Mike,
     Thank you; those are some great frags.  There is a lot to be learned from pieces like that.
Would sure like some close ups of the ring ratchet model.
Regards,
John

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: CarlS on February 23, 2011, 05:51:22 PM

Mike: Very cool.  Much cooler display than the band saw examples occasionally seen.

John:  Having held both sabot types there is no doubt it saved copper!

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 24, 2011, 12:14:08 AM

Playing around here to see if PhotoBucket works to get bigger files:

(http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff458/emike123/DSCN0781.jpg)

It does, it does!

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 24, 2011, 09:00:11 AM

Mike,
   Hey that is okay!   Will the Archer Fuze remove for a nice photo for us?
John

P.S. over on the right where the 'reply' is, can those letters be darkened to see them better?

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 24, 2011, 03:25:02 PM

Its a bit smooshed from being fired out of a 7" gun, then burrowing 3-4 feet into a bank before blowing up, but it is the type of Archer fuse that was "drilled out" to accept a paper time fuse.

(http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff458/emike123/DSCN0792.jpg)

(http://i1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff458/emike123/DSCN0793.jpg)

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 24, 2011, 08:18:20 PM

Mike,
   Ugh!  what a ugly fuze.  Is that part of the shell threads under the fuze head?
John

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 24, 2011, 08:40:42 PM

Easy John.  You're insulting my stuff ;-) 

You slam head first into a hillside and lay buried there for 145 years and we'll see how you look!

I think what you're describing is the bushing similar to the type used in watercap fused shells.

Here, I cleaned it up for you

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 24, 2011, 08:43:38 PM

Side view

I think its a handsome fuse sort of like that Christmas Tree in Charlie Brown's Christmas

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4Hv9YmhGpw

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 24, 2011, 10:36:05 PM

Ahhhh much better, crooked as a dog's hind leg.   From head on it doesn't look like an Archer Safety Pin fuze, more like a paper time fuse adapter.   By golly it really took some impact.  It is hard to believe that it could fire.  However, the ground burst is evidence that it did.
    Any idea why it had two sets of spanner slots?

'Eating humble pie' :)
John

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 25, 2011, 12:13:57 AM

My opinion about the two sets of slots in the head is that they were actually being pretty smart.  The spanner wrench that was for these would work great, but if it was lost or a tine broke off, the slot across the head allowed them to use any straight edged piece of metal to screw this fuse adapter in.

Toward the end of the war they got even smarter and in some cases got rid of the stupid spanner holes altogether in favor of the simple slot.

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 25, 2011, 08:53:58 AM

Ahh, how clever.  I am sure that cut into their percussion fuze stocks, I wonder why not just make a time fuse adapter that would fit the shell threads.
I see "you are here to save the day" :) no more space character?  This image will not expand to larger size.  May I have a side and top view and an angled shot showing both?
Thanks for sharing these unusual shots.
All the Best,
John

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: John D. Bartleson Jr. on February 25, 2011, 10:45:39 AM

Mike,
     The fuze head on your last posting appears to have a thinner head.  Could the Archer Safety Pin fuze below be the one in your grond burst shell?
Sorry, didn't have a view of the head on this one.
Regards,
John aka Bart

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 25, 2011, 10:58:54 AM

The brown one in my later post is the same type as the one in the groundburst -- that is to say "drilled out" to be a fuse adapter.  It is not a percussion fuse, but the channel for the paper fuse is filled with dirt.

Title: Re: Brooke's Ring Ratchet Sabot System;
Post by: emike123 on February 25, 2011, 02:28:19 PM

My Mighty Mouse icon is from a cartoon Cel I have hanging in my relic room, purchased in a moment of weakness.  I still think Marvin the Martian is one of the greatest characters in cartoon history, and here is my "throwback" icon from the predecessor site...