The Selma Projectile;

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Mike,
  Interesting observation.   Can you post a colose-up sharp focused shot of a Selma sabot with the marking in good view?   Thanks.  That would hint that it is not from the U.K. and the Blakely foundries.
Regards,
John

[jamesshell]

MIKE, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.. IT'S BEEN YEARS SINCE I'VE HAD A SIMILAR DISCUSSION REGARDING THIS TOPIC.. I'VE HEARD SPECULATION THAT THEY MARKED THE SABOTS TO INDICATED THE TYPE OF SHELLS TO MAKE AND WHERE THEY NEEDED TO GO, DUE TO THE FACT THAT THE 3.67 BLAKELY RIFLE, LOCATED AT FT BLAKELEY, COULD NOT BEAR A HEAVIER 20LB SHELL DESIGNED FOR A 20LB PARROTT RIFLE.. BUT THAT DOES NOT EXPLAIN THE UNMARKED SABOTS I HAVE FROM FT BLAKELEY, AL? SO WHO KNOWS?? THIS DISCUSSION WAS PURE SPECULATION.. WELL TO BE HONEST.. IT WAS A LITTLE BIT OF "DRUNK" TALK ... REGARDS JAIME 

[emike123]

I do not have one of the ones stamped "Blakeley," John.  Someone else posted a picture of one.  The ones I have seen did not have very clear stamps.

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Hello Jamie,
   Do you know what rifled cannon was in Fort Blakeley?  Any 3.68 inch rifled James ?
Mike are you sure the Blakeley stamped sabot sabot did not measure 3.68 rather than .67? that is a pretty close measurement.
Regards,
John

[emike123]

John, I think that a read of the remarks in the 1993 D&G on pages 103 and 104 will help answer some of these questions for you.

I have seen about 10 and never seen them with the 15 lands and grooves that all but the first 6 or 7 James rifles had.

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Mike,
   Thank you kindly.  It did answer one but not the one I previously asked you about the sabot diameter.
 am I to understand that all but the first 6 or 7 re-rifled James had 15/15 rifling? and the rifles at Fort Blakeley were Blakely rifles with fewer lands and grooves?
  At the risk of boring our readers, I was trying to prove that the Selma sabots stamped with "Blakeley" were cast for specifically for the Blakely rifle found at Fort Blakeley.
   Just one more and I will secure my input to this apparent drivel. Has anyone ever checked the bottom of the shell base of one having this "Blakeley" mark  to see if there is a high or low relief "Blakeley" mark in the shell base?
Regards,
John

[emike123]

John, there were scores of cannon at Ft. Blakely (it was a major defensive position for Mobile), but the evidence I referred you to is that there was a Balekly gun in redoubt #4.  Selma Hunter may be able to provide you with a list of most of the tubes that were used at Blakely, but he'll have to call in a favor and so I suggest you handle it with him offline.

I have never seen a maker's mark on the bottom of one of these sabots. 

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Dear Mike,
   Without reference to ask for a complete cannon listing of Fort Blakeley can anyone answer my questions on my previous posting? There is at least one sabot with the word "Blakeley" cast or stamped  next to the 'dove-tail' post.
You can see it on the prior posts that Carl made reference to.
   Forgive me if I retire from this topic. It seems to be endless.
Regards,
John

[emike123]

I thought you meant on the bottom of the sabot but upon re-reading, you probably mean on the iron part opposite the place on the top of the copper sabot to see if it was cast on.  I do have 2 exploded ones, but neither has a legible mirror image mark in the iron. 

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Thanks Mike,
This was my question about the shell base, not on sabot:

     "Has anyone ever checked the bottom of the shell base of one having this "Blakeley" mark  to see if there is a high or low relief "Blakeley" mark in the shell base?"
Kind Regards,
John

[CarlS]

I've seen a couple with the stamping on the side buried in the iron but never seen or heard mention of any marking on the exposed side.

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Carl,
I didn't mean on the exposed side of the sabot.
I meant on the base of the shell body.
John

[CarlS]

John,

Not seen that either but for the iron to be exposed it would likely have to come from some fragments that someone looked close enough to see.  The shell is rare so I'm sure the frags are at least as rare.  The stamping on the base is so light that it would be at least as light in the iron and when you add rust and the rarity of the fragments I'm not surprised I've not seen any iron marked like that.  I don't have a frag example to look at.

Best,
Carl

[John D. Bartleson Jr.]

Case closed I guess.
John

[jamesshell]

JOHN,

  SORRY IT TOOK SO LONG FOR ME TO GET BACK TO YOU.... YES THERE WERE JAMES RIFLES IN FT BLAKELEY USED BY THE CONFEDERATES... I OWN A 3.67 SELMA SHELL WITH 15X15 LANDS AND GROOVES, I USED TO OWN A 3.67 SELMA BOLT WITH 15X15 LANDS AND GROOVES TOO, IN ADDITION I HAVE THE BASE OF A 3.8 C/S READ SHELL.  ALL WERE RECOVERED FROM FT BLAKELEY.  I HOPE THAT HELPS YOU OUT? JAIME R