M&M 291 through M&M 312

[AggieReb]

Removed

[ETEX]

Wes I agree with your take and have added some additional information.

MM-291 was called a British Sea Service for so long and now they have pretty much been given the name Louisiana Troops Bullet. Several variants are found with deeper, squarer, and crisper grooves with a variety of lengths from .910 to 1.065.

MM-292/293 called Musketoons appear to be the same bullet. There is definitely variants out there with the different profiles to the nose. I also agree the Jenkins Ferry Musketoon is a stand alone bullet with the upper body much longer than the MM-292/293. At one time many thought this bullet was a cut off 69 Caliber 3 Ringer. I believe that has pretty much gone by the wayside with this bullet recognized as a bullet.

MM-295 has always been questionable to me. I believe it is a cut off minie.

MM-296 Uncertain - could this be a fired or blown out MM-297.

MM-297/298/299 have been called Suhls, German Suhls, Dresdens for so long the name has stuck with these bullets probably always referred as the above. New information in RBTRF IV shows the 297 as a 58 Caliber Tennessee Rifle bullet and the MM-298/299 being for the 54 Caliber Mississippi Rifle and found with nose and side cast and possibly from Nashville Arsenal. I have nose cast and side cast in my collection. I was always curious why MM had labeled the MM-297 for Union use with the 298/299 associated with the CS.

MM-301 comes in I don't know how many cavity variants. I have a dish, a cone, a plug, and a dish with a teat. Agree with Wes on the bullet. Great bullet. I love the 301.

MM-302/303 I agree as Kerr bullets but now known as a Tennessee Rifle bullet.

MM-305 Macon works for me Wes, don't understand the conical cavity on this bullet with flat base variants found.

MM-310 may get some attention. I believe this to be a 58 Caliber Burnside as referenced in "SCWB". I have a bullet that is very close to this bullet that measures .577 x .816 x 345 with my bullet having a flat base. The bullet I have is heavily corroded at the base.

[Skip]

Hi Folks,

I apologize for not posting more often. Just wanted to add my two cents worth to this thread with a few personal observations.

First I've never heard of a British Sea Service being dug in the TM. All that means is that if they have been dug over here it's news to me. I have found a few at Holly Springs, Mississippi, and have seen others that were dug in eastern Tennessee and northern Mississippi.

The M&M 292 and 293 are not the same bullet. The "Arkansas Musketoon" has a pointed nose and an essentric rim while the "Port Hudson Musketoon" has a rounded nose and a concentric rim. Also they are not intermingled but found in distinct separate areas. The 292 is found in IT, Missouri, Arkansas and the Texas coastal area. The 293 is found around Port Hudson and in western Mississippi.

This is a guess on my part (Dean, please feel free to chime in) but I believe that the Arkansas Musketoon was produced at the Saint Louis Arsenal while the Port Hudson Musketoon was made at the Baton Rouge Arsenal. The 292 was used by colored troops notably the First Kansas Colored - the first black regiment to enlist and to see combat (take that, 54th Mass.).

Have only seen a few Oldenberg Tiges and they all came from Port Hudson.

M&M 301 is a two groove lube groove enfield. Compare it to M&M 350 and the .54 caliber three groove lube groove enfield. A large quantity of two band enfields came into the TM at the mouth of the Rio Grande and the molds probably came with them.

Y'all are doing a great job trying to sort things out. Unfortunately there are some questions that will probably never be answered.

[R. J. in LA]

MM-291: I saw a British Sea Service that was dug around New Roads, LA, west of the Mississippi River from the Port Hudson area.  I have heard of some dug in Port Hudson but have not seen them so I know of at least one that I have seen was dug in the TM.
Good threads going, thanks.

R. J.

[Skip]

Hi Wes and All,

Sorry for miswording the comments about M&M 301. These bullets were definately made at TM arsenals. What I meant to say is that the molds were lube groove .54 cal. enfield molds that were probably shipped through the blockade along with the rifles. It wasn't uncommon to ship molds with the weapons.

It does bring up an interesting question. Why did the lube groove enfield molds that came in through east coast ports have three grooves while those coming in through the Rio Grande only had two grooves?

[Skip]

Thanks, R.J.

It's good to know they have been found in the TM. Hope some made it up this way.

On another note your guys have to play us in the Rock this year so Les needs to win all his games. Then we can have another battle of the undefeateds.

[coonboy]

I do not know where they were manufactured but I can say for a fact that I have dug at least three around the Hill here and I sold two of them to either Danny or Mike when they bought most of my minie collection. Coonboy

[ETEX]

The one in my collection came out of Grenada, Mississippi but I have seen and heard of numerous that were dug in Louisiana. I don't recall seeing are hearing about any being dug in Arkansas.

Terry it's great seeing you post again. Hope you are feeling much better.

[Daveslem]

Welcome back, Terry. Hope all is well with you.

[emike123]

I have this one: 54 Mississippi Rifle (MM 301) with truncated convex cavity with small teat. Found by Terry Waxham at Pleasant Hill, LA

I spoke to old Gator Bait (Danny) Sunday.  He can no longer see well enough to frequent these boards, but he is still his same old self and we miss his wit and wisdom here.  He had a bad cold for about a month but sounds better now.

Glad you're better too, Terry.  John R. and I were just chatting about paying you a visit sometime soon when you are up for it.  Gotta be before snake season.  Like Indiana Jones, I hate snakes.

[R. J. in LA]

Skip,
Terry & I hope the Tigers will be undefeated again going to the Rock to play the undefeated Hogs! Of course we hope the Tigers prevail! 

R. J.

[R. J. in LA]

Terry,

I thought I had seen some MM-291 British Sea Service examples at your museum that you had found locally but didn't know if my mind was playing tricks on me or not.  Glad you contributed your knowledge to the forum.

Talk to you later,

R. J.

[R. J. in LA]

Mike,

Keep me posted when you & John R can work it out with Terry for a visit, I can come up to meet y'all so we can all talk relic talk, enjoy ourselves, & I can learn a lot more from you guys!

R. J.

[Lazouave]

Hi RJ,
Relic talk sounds good.  Terry, Mike, you and me that -  sounds like relic steroids!

[Lazouave]

Rj,
here are pics of a couple of Pt hudson Sea Service.